In the recent thread about contributors, Anna Kreider made some points that I’m taking to heart about token diversity and how adding non-cishetwhitedudes purely for stretch goals can translate into them doing unpaid marketing work.
I’m planning a KS and mulling over how to compensate contributors fairly. I’m really curious about this one-time payment vs. royalties side of things. So far I had been thinking of this as psychological sleight of hand–like, I THINK the problem is when contributors simply aren’t paid enough in total, and less important whether that comes from up-front or royalty payments.
So basically I’m wondering if I’m way off on that. (I mean, I can see how the see-saw between the two types of pay could be used to obfuscate an exploitative deal.)
I once got royalties – unexpectedly! – from a generous soul, and I felt like a million bucks to get surprise money (it was tiny, but yay gifts). Until then I had been steadfastly trying to get all my freelancing money up front, because I figured I had no idea how to assess what a very small press book was going to sell, and no faith in my ability to hold a publisher accountable when I had no way to even guess their sales numbers.
From the publisher’s side (my new vantage point), one-time payments for all rights means that projects with lots of contributors don’t accumulate a lot of stakeholders – I mean, assuming they’re paid more than for less permissive rights.
On the other hand, maybe this is side hustle thinking, and someone living a more precarious perma-freelance lifestyle really benefits from royalties to even out cash flow?
I’ve never had to pay anyone other than myself for a project, let me get that out of the way first.
I did however run a failed KS back in 2013(?) where I was attempting to pay artists. Part of my failure was that I didn’t have art commissioned to start. Honestly I was experimenting with the platform to see what was possible, I pushed too far in a few respects.
So that’s where I’m coming from. The point is, I refused to let the artists give me any art before I paid them. A few of them offered. As a small nobody, it would be unethical for me to offer royalties. The artist would never get paid.
A big name publisher can honestly offer royalties and know if the contributors will get a decent amount of money off it. You are at the mercy of there evaluation at that point. Even with the most accomplished company could tank a product and you’d get burned on a royalties pay scheme. Then again, if it was an amazing success, maybe you’d do better than expected.
There’s not a huge chance of an upside to royalties. It’s almost always better for the contributors to know up front what they’re getting paid.
I’ve never had to pay anyone other than myself for a project, let me get that out of the way first.
I did however run a failed KS back in 2013(?) where I was attempting to pay artists. Part of my failure was that I didn’t have art commissioned to start. Honestly I was experimenting with the platform to see what was possible, I pushed too far in a few respects.
So that’s where I’m coming from. The point is, I refused to let the artists give me any art before I paid them. A few of them offered. As a small nobody, it would be unethical for me to offer royalties. The artist would never get paid.
A big name publisher can honestly offer royalties and know if the contributors will get a decent amount of money off it. You are at the mercy of there evaluation at that point. Even with the most accomplished company could tank a product and you’d get burned on a royalties pay scheme. Then again, if it was an amazing success, maybe you’d do better than expected.
There’s not a huge chance of an upside to royalties. It’s almost always better for the contributors to know up front what they’re getting paid.
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Some hustler-thinking in favour of royalties: it gives the freelancer an incentive to keep promoting your product.
Some hustler-thinking in favour of royalties: it gives the freelancer an incentive to keep promoting your product.
Summoning Jason Lutes, who probably has some good insight on this.
Summoning Jason Lutes, who probably has some good insight on this.
📌
📌
The royalty versus not pay issue was sort of a side issue to my main point that tokenizing women by bolting them on as stretch goals in ways that require them to do free labor for not guarantee of payment is crappy, especially when you consider that the average freelance writing rate just isn’t a fair rate in terms of time to produce professional content.
Obviously for small players, the economics are different. But even for medium-small publishers like myself, who you hire becomes a thing.
I’m not trying to crap on people running solo outfits. I’m more aiming my beef at people with operations large enough that they have a development team of 2 or more people, 1-2 layout artist, and more than 2-3 pieces of art, who still manage to end up with all dude creative teams. Because that makes the “bolt on diversity through stretch goals” as an afterthought more obvious.
The royalty versus not pay issue was sort of a side issue to my main point that tokenizing women by bolting them on as stretch goals in ways that require them to do free labor for not guarantee of payment is crappy, especially when you consider that the average freelance writing rate just isn’t a fair rate in terms of time to produce professional content.
Obviously for small players, the economics are different. But even for medium-small publishers like myself, who you hire becomes a thing.
I’m not trying to crap on people running solo outfits. I’m more aiming my beef at people with operations large enough that they have a development team of 2 or more people, 1-2 layout artist, and more than 2-3 pieces of art, who still manage to end up with all dude creative teams. Because that makes the “bolt on diversity through stretch goals” as an afterthought more obvious.
Anna Kreider My wife and daughter point out my spelling and grammatical errors, does that count for anything? 😛
My wife is credited as my editor on my 280 page book. I forgot to credit my playtesters on my 80 page game. It’s hard to remember all things I’m supposed to do while trying to make an actual living.
And now I’m totally rambling without any point to make.
Anna Kreider My wife and daughter point out my spelling and grammatical errors, does that count for anything? 😛
My wife is credited as my editor on my 280 page book. I forgot to credit my playtesters on my 80 page game. It’s hard to remember all things I’m supposed to do while trying to make an actual living.
And now I’m totally rambling without any point to make.
Anna Kreider thanks for that, that makes a lot of sense.
Anna Kreider thanks for that, that makes a lot of sense.
Jeremy Strandberg, as it happens Jason Lutes was that very same generous benefactor that was sending me money unexpectedly.
Jeremy Strandberg, as it happens Jason Lutes was that very same generous benefactor that was sending me money unexpectedly.
Listening
Listening
I would probably put the question to the contributor. Asking if they would rather have up front or royalties or some mix. If they have a preference, make them an offer and ask if they think it is fair. If they don’t, suggest they counter offer what they do think is fair. Ultimately, if it’s a business decision, you want to make sure you don’t burn your contributors or they will not think highly of you, may give you grief/bad press, and ultimately may not work with you again.
I would probably put the question to the contributor. Asking if they would rather have up front or royalties or some mix. If they have a preference, make them an offer and ask if they think it is fair. If they don’t, suggest they counter offer what they do think is fair. Ultimately, if it’s a business decision, you want to make sure you don’t burn your contributors or they will not think highly of you, may give you grief/bad press, and ultimately may not work with you again.
Having done a lot of commercial illustration work myself, when I Kickstarted my first RPG book I wanted a payment model that compensated artists according to how I myself would like to get paid for similar work.
Art is generally treated as a raw resource by editors/art directors/publishers, but good art can have a direct impact on the sales of the thing, so some sort of royalty approach made sense to me. If a given book sells really well over time, I believe the artists (and writers) deserve a piece of that.
I pay contributors an advance upon delivery of the work, against a royalty based on the size and placement of the contribution. So for instance, a cover might be $100 up front against a 3% royalty, while a single quarter-page interior illo might be $25 against a 1% royalty. If at the end of the first accounting cycle the book has made $5000, the cover artist’s royalty would be $150 and the interior artist’s royalty would be $50; after subtracting the advances from those figures, I would Paypal them $50 and $25, respectively.
The only drawback to this approach that I’ve encountered so far is the ongoing accounting. As I continue to produce books, more names get added to the “payroll,” and bookkeeping increases on my end. It’s not terrible, but I’m not the most organized person. As a result I’m thinking about maybe capping the total royalty paid out for a given contribution (e.g., $500 for the above-mentioned cover artist) or something similar.
The upside, aside from feeling like I’m paying people how I would like to be paid in similar circumstances, is that it feels really good to send out those royalty payments!
Having done a lot of commercial illustration work myself, when I Kickstarted my first RPG book I wanted a payment model that compensated artists according to how I myself would like to get paid for similar work.
Art is generally treated as a raw resource by editors/art directors/publishers, but good art can have a direct impact on the sales of the thing, so some sort of royalty approach made sense to me. If a given book sells really well over time, I believe the artists (and writers) deserve a piece of that.
I pay contributors an advance upon delivery of the work, against a royalty based on the size and placement of the contribution. So for instance, a cover might be $100 up front against a 3% royalty, while a single quarter-page interior illo might be $25 against a 1% royalty. If at the end of the first accounting cycle the book has made $5000, the cover artist’s royalty would be $150 and the interior artist’s royalty would be $50; after subtracting the advances from those figures, I would Paypal them $50 and $25, respectively.
The only drawback to this approach that I’ve encountered so far is the ongoing accounting. As I continue to produce books, more names get added to the “payroll,” and bookkeeping increases on my end. It’s not terrible, but I’m not the most organized person. As a result I’m thinking about maybe capping the total royalty paid out for a given contribution (e.g., $500 for the above-mentioned cover artist) or something similar.
The upside, aside from feeling like I’m paying people how I would like to be paid in similar circumstances, is that it feels really good to send out those royalty payments!
This is definitely a side quest from Anna’s post, but I think there’s some important things to think about as the small publisher too.
1. Are you printing a single print run or is there a chance of multiple print runs? Are you selling digital copies? How many copies are you expecting to sell, and is there room in your business plan for this book to be pleasantly surprised?
2. When you offer royalties versus up front payment, do the royalties potentially only add up to or do they potentially increase the amount of money you could offer instead of an up-front payment? If they only match it, delaying delivery of income is not super helpful.
Royalties, imo, benefit creators when they allow them to share in the success of a successful project with their publisher. If offered a smaller advance but a royalty percentage in lieu of a larger all-at-once payment, I, as a freelancer, have to weigh the money-now against the perceived likelihood of even-more-money-but-later. I have to decide how successful your project will be.
I’m literally taking on risk when I go for royalties instead of a larger flat fee, and I only do that for projects I believe in.
To tie this back to Anna’s post, if you’re starting to prioritize hiring diverse freelancers, consider that asking them to take a smaller advance and hope your project does well enough for them to earn royalties that not only make up the rest of their paycheck but also make up for the wait, that’s not a small ask. Make sure you’re not only offering this to minority writers – and weigh the risk you’re putting on them.
Only you know the inside numbers of how your publishing is going, and you may know very well that royalties will pay better than a larger flat fee, but you still have to earn the trust or catch the passion of freelancers you offer this deal to.
Jason Lutes I have seen some royalty contracts where there’s a time limit on how long after a printing royalties will get calculated. Not sure how that works with digital distribution, but a time limit is a potential boundary that could simplify your accounting maybe?
This is definitely a side quest from Anna’s post, but I think there’s some important things to think about as the small publisher too.
1. Are you printing a single print run or is there a chance of multiple print runs? Are you selling digital copies? How many copies are you expecting to sell, and is there room in your business plan for this book to be pleasantly surprised?
2. When you offer royalties versus up front payment, do the royalties potentially only add up to or do they potentially increase the amount of money you could offer instead of an up-front payment? If they only match it, delaying delivery of income is not super helpful.
Royalties, imo, benefit creators when they allow them to share in the success of a successful project with their publisher. If offered a smaller advance but a royalty percentage in lieu of a larger all-at-once payment, I, as a freelancer, have to weigh the money-now against the perceived likelihood of even-more-money-but-later. I have to decide how successful your project will be.
I’m literally taking on risk when I go for royalties instead of a larger flat fee, and I only do that for projects I believe in.
To tie this back to Anna’s post, if you’re starting to prioritize hiring diverse freelancers, consider that asking them to take a smaller advance and hope your project does well enough for them to earn royalties that not only make up the rest of their paycheck but also make up for the wait, that’s not a small ask. Make sure you’re not only offering this to minority writers – and weigh the risk you’re putting on them.
Only you know the inside numbers of how your publishing is going, and you may know very well that royalties will pay better than a larger flat fee, but you still have to earn the trust or catch the passion of freelancers you offer this deal to.
Jason Lutes I have seen some royalty contracts where there’s a time limit on how long after a printing royalties will get calculated. Not sure how that works with digital distribution, but a time limit is a potential boundary that could simplify your accounting maybe?
Thanks for the generous answers, all, this is helpful.
Thanks for the generous answers, all, this is helpful.
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With Legacy 2e I gave stretch goal authors the choice of a per word rate (£0.07/word), half on first draft and half on final draft, or an equal share of the net profits with an up-front payment on first draft that royalties will be counted against. It worked out 50/50 who went with which arrangement, which I think is a good sign?
I had one woman in the original 5-person creative team (one editor), and I definitely did try and bolster that with stretch goals. In the end we had 5 male and 2 female writers, 1 female editor, 1 male layout artist, and 1 male and 3 female artists. Still not parity, and I’m going to make sure that that’s an explicit priority for my next project rather than just muddling along and only considering it when it comes time to ask for funding.
With Legacy 2e I gave stretch goal authors the choice of a per word rate (£0.07/word), half on first draft and half on final draft, or an equal share of the net profits with an up-front payment on first draft that royalties will be counted against. It worked out 50/50 who went with which arrangement, which I think is a good sign?
I had one woman in the original 5-person creative team (one editor), and I definitely did try and bolster that with stretch goals. In the end we had 5 male and 2 female writers, 1 female editor, 1 male layout artist, and 1 male and 3 female artists. Still not parity, and I’m going to make sure that that’s an explicit priority for my next project rather than just muddling along and only considering it when it comes time to ask for funding.
Oh, and in reference to Rachel Kahn ‘s point above, I hadn’t run the numbers beforehand on estimated value of both options and I really should have to make sure I was giving a fair choice! It’s worked out that the royalty-havers will get at least as much as the fixed fee even ignoring pdf sales, but that’s definitely another oversight.
Oh, and in reference to Rachel Kahn ‘s point above, I hadn’t run the numbers beforehand on estimated value of both options and I really should have to make sure I was giving a fair choice! It’s worked out that the royalty-havers will get at least as much as the fixed fee even ignoring pdf sales, but that’s definitely another oversight.
If you’re going to offer royalties, make sure you spell out under what circumstances you pay money in the contract. It’s been a traditional sort of dodge to offer royalties as soon as something turns a profit, and then never end up paying because there are always expenses. You also want to be careful about what royalties mean for the IP you’re creating — do you intend to do anything else with it? If so, you need to address ongoing rights, particularly if there are royalties involved. For myself, we pay half on first draft/sketches, and then the rest upon delivery of the final, and we pay better than industry standard — more so if you work for us more than once and all goes well. We use our KS stretch goals as a test ground for future hires (and to build relationships with other designers). Thinking past the current project to the long term helps us avoid some of these pitfalls.
If you’re going to offer royalties, make sure you spell out under what circumstances you pay money in the contract. It’s been a traditional sort of dodge to offer royalties as soon as something turns a profit, and then never end up paying because there are always expenses. You also want to be careful about what royalties mean for the IP you’re creating — do you intend to do anything else with it? If so, you need to address ongoing rights, particularly if there are royalties involved. For myself, we pay half on first draft/sketches, and then the rest upon delivery of the final, and we pay better than industry standard — more so if you work for us more than once and all goes well. We use our KS stretch goals as a test ground for future hires (and to build relationships with other designers). Thinking past the current project to the long term helps us avoid some of these pitfalls.