I just finally finished listening to all the episodes of the podcast, and now that I’m done (until new episodes come out) I wanted to say something.
Let me preface this with the fact that I absolutely love the show. It is tied with Alex Roberts new podcast for my favourite podcast actually.
That said, there is one niggling annoyance that I just wanted to get out there. Storygames are not all low crunch, and trad games are not all heavy crunch. Fudge for instance? Totally low crunch trad game. And Chuubo’s Marvelous Wish-Granting Engine has to be yhe most storyest storygame that ever did storygame, and that corebook is thicker than the Hero corebook.
Anyway, I just wanted to let that out there. I totally love your show and I can’t wait to hear more of it.
I completely agree with you, Joshua Hillerup !
My preference is low crunch first, then I lean towards small book games. That is often Story Games, but not always.
There are some more conventional games that fit my wheelhouse. Like High Strung, for example. And Ninja Burger RPG, too.
I completely agree with you, Joshua Hillerup !
My preference is low crunch first, then I lean towards small book games. That is often Story Games, but not always.
There are some more conventional games that fit my wheelhouse. Like High Strung, for example. And Ninja Burger RPG, too.
I’m glad you’re enjoying the show, Joshua Hillerup.
I guess the terms “traditional,” “story” and (especially) “indie” aren’t super-helpful, since there is no widely-held definition for any of them. They all kind of square with that famous saying about porn: “You know it when you see it.” But even then, a lot of it is pretty subjective.
I’m glad you’re enjoying the show, Joshua Hillerup.
I guess the terms “traditional,” “story” and (especially) “indie” aren’t super-helpful, since there is no widely-held definition for any of them. They all kind of square with that famous saying about porn: “You know it when you see it.” But even then, a lot of it is pretty subjective.
Jason Cordova sure, like the time I heard a podcaster (different podcast) say that they prefer Dungeon World over storygames like Vampire the Masquerade. That one made my head hurt.
But still, I think there’s something to what we’re talking about with these terms, and I really don’t think that size of the book or number of rules has anything to do with it.
Jason Cordova sure, like the time I heard a podcaster (different podcast) say that they prefer Dungeon World over storygames like Vampire the Masquerade. That one made my head hurt.
But still, I think there’s something to what we’re talking about with these terms, and I really don’t think that size of the book or number of rules has anything to do with it.
It comes back to definitions and terms of art. Some have been established, some are more ambiguous. Generally when I think of trad games, they have a more simulation focused style, in which a player character is heavily invested in maintaining one character. The investment in a single character usually means a lot more rules around character creation and leveling, leading to more “crunch.” Another feature of more traditional style games “again, this in general” is the frequency of handwaving or modifying rules, rather than playing as written.
In general I think of story games as lower investment in one character with an emphasis on telling the best story with the characters in play. Sometimes the best story is to the detriment of your held PC, and that is ok in story games. Also, the tendency to play rules as written is increased.
Dungeon World is almost like a hybrid between these two definitions. Players are encouraged to invest more heavily in a single character than story games, but not as heavily as more traditional dungeon crawler games. The game is a simulation dungeon crawl, but it abstracts many of the “crunchier” parts of a dungeon crawl. This tends towards faster “on screen” action. I can be played rules as written, but in the rule book, the authors give permission and tools to help house rule! Maybe this hybrid model is why I like dungeon world so much. For me, it’s getting some of the best out of traditional and story games.
It comes back to definitions and terms of art. Some have been established, some are more ambiguous. Generally when I think of trad games, they have a more simulation focused style, in which a player character is heavily invested in maintaining one character. The investment in a single character usually means a lot more rules around character creation and leveling, leading to more “crunch.” Another feature of more traditional style games “again, this in general” is the frequency of handwaving or modifying rules, rather than playing as written.
In general I think of story games as lower investment in one character with an emphasis on telling the best story with the characters in play. Sometimes the best story is to the detriment of your held PC, and that is ok in story games. Also, the tendency to play rules as written is increased.
Dungeon World is almost like a hybrid between these two definitions. Players are encouraged to invest more heavily in a single character than story games, but not as heavily as more traditional dungeon crawler games. The game is a simulation dungeon crawl, but it abstracts many of the “crunchier” parts of a dungeon crawl. This tends towards faster “on screen” action. I can be played rules as written, but in the rule book, the authors give permission and tools to help house rule! Maybe this hybrid model is why I like dungeon world so much. For me, it’s getting some of the best out of traditional and story games.